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MarkUK
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Date Posted:15/05/2021 04:52:50Copy HTML

As lovers of history all of us have come across some perplexing mysteries. Over the here we have the Princes in the Tower and Jack the Ripper, over there you have the Roanoake colonists and Amelia Earhart among many others.

But for me the most frustrating is a local mystery - the Battle of Stafford. We know neither the precise date nor the exact location, all we have is "late 1069" during the Saxon resistance to Norman rule in England. 

William the Conquerer, who had seized the Throne in 1066, was faced with almost continuous uprisings in the first five years of his reign. In 1069 the wonderfully named Edric the Wild led a rebellion in the west of England, with Welsh support he attacked the Normans along the Welsh Marches. It was an army led by King William himself that finally defeated Edric at Stafford in 1069. But for such an important event we know almost nothing about it.

Even one of the most authoritative works on the period Anglo-Saxon England by Sir Frank Stenton deals with it in just a few words - "he set out from Lindsey for Stafford, where the insurgents were concentrated. After defeating them in what his admirers called an easy victory, he began the return march to Lindsey". And that is all he has to say on the matter.    

Now that the site of the Battle of Brunanburh has been satisfactorily located historians ought to turn their attention to locating the site of the Battle of Stafford. 

You're playing chess with Fate and Fate's winning. Arnold Bennett
shula Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #1
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Re:Historical Mysteries

Date Posted:15/05/2021 10:07:53Copy HTML

Mystery of the Mary Celeste.


Mary Celeste  was an American merchant  brigantine discovered adrift and deserted in the Atlantic Ocean off the zores Azores Islands on December 4, 1872. The Canadian brigantine Dei Gratia found her in a dishevelled but seaworthy condition under partial sail and with her lifeboat missing. The last entry in her log was dated ten days earlier. She had left New York City for Genoa on November 7 and was still amply provisioned when found. Her cargo of denatured alcohol was intact, and the captain's and crew's personal belongings were undisturbed. None of those who had been on board were ever seen or heard from again.

"It is forbidden to spit on cats in plague-time." -Albert Camus-
PBA-3rd-1949 Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #2
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Re:Historical Mysteries

Date Posted:15/05/2021 11:29:33Copy HTML

Mystery of the Mary Celeste.


Mary Celeste  was an American merchant  brigantine discovered adrift and deserted in the Atlantic Ocean off the zores Azores Islands on December 4, 1872. The Canadian brigantine Dei Gratia found her in a dishevelled but seaworthy condition under partial sail and with her lifeboat missing. The last entry in her log was dated ten days earlier. She had left New York City for Genoa on November 7 and was still amply provisioned when found. Her cargo of denatured alcohol was intact, and the captain's and crew's personal belongings were undisturbed. None of those who had been on board were ever seen or heard from again.


Well if you check where the Azores are the ship would get the hot dry winds from it's east from western Africa. That's where most of your hurricanes start off from each year.

Also look at this weather chart and the ship wasn't discovered until into Dec and started off in Hurricane season.

You also noted the ship was untidy and under partial sail but her life boat was missing. Storm came up and threw everything around on the ship including cargo until the crew got scared and took to the life boat. Then the winds would have carried them back toward North America and sank in rough seas mystery solved.

See the source image

PBA-3rd-1949 Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #3
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Re:Historical Mysteries

Date Posted:15/05/2021 11:55:39Copy HTML


So do you think Shula that a small 14-15 foot wooden life boat could survive theses waves in the Atlantic?

Very unlikely.

shula Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #4
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Re:Historical Mysteries

Date Posted:16/05/2021 02:04:45Copy HTML

I have no idea.  I've only been out on a sailboat and a canoe.  What do I know about boats?  The Mary Celeste was listed as one of America's mysteries and Mark wants mysteries.  Sounds like you've solved this one, though.
"It is forbidden to spit on cats in plague-time." -Albert Camus-
MarkUK Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #5
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Re:Historical Mysteries

Date Posted:16/05/2021 07:26:31Copy HTML

I've seen a TV programme that suggests that the crew got into the "lifeboat" within sight of the Azores following some suspected danger from the unstable cargo, but they never made the few miles to land.     

You're playing chess with Fate and Fate's winning. Arnold Bennett
shula Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #6
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Re:Historical Mysteries

Date Posted:16/05/2021 10:37:43Copy HTML

That sounds a reasonable explanation.  In the ocean their bodies would never be found.


On land here in the U.S., the body of Teamster boss Jimmy Hoffa has never been found.  He disappeared on 30 July 1975 in Oakland County, Michigan.  Numerous clues and a confession of the whereabouts of his body have proved fruitless to this day.

"It is forbidden to spit on cats in plague-time." -Albert Camus-
PBA-3rd-1949 Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #7
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Re:Historical Mysteries

Date Posted:17/05/2021 12:26:02Copy HTML

I have no idea.  I've only been out on a sailboat and a canoe.  What do I know about boats?  The Mary Celeste was listed as one of America's mysteries and Mark wants mysteries.  Sounds like you've solved this one, though.


Most so call Mysteries can be solved with modern records and equipment now. Some things are made Mysteries to attract tourists. The Lockness monster is one of them.

shula Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #8
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Re:Historical Mysteries

Date Posted:17/05/2021 01:30:53Copy HTML

This is true of some mysteries.  Mark wants mysteries as opposed to myths.  The location of that battle near his home and the disappearance of Hoffa are mysteries.  The lochness monster is a myth or a legend. 
"It is forbidden to spit on cats in plague-time." -Albert Camus-
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Re:Historical Mysteries

Date Posted:17/05/2021 09:07:39Copy HTML

I've seen a TV programme that suggests that the crew got into the "lifeboat" within sight of the Azores following some suspected danger from the unstable cargo, but they never made the few miles to land.     


There must have been bad weather to make the cargo unstable in the first place Mark and enough of it to make the crew take to the life boat. 

Shula has only been out in a canoe and sail boat she says, so I can imagine what shape her knickers would be in if she was out in 30 ft swells. Would probably make a good movie though, eh.

Yes we need more Mysteries to examine.


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